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strike cycle upgrade


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  • strike cycle upgrade

    I have one last fix I would like to do before leagues restart next week.....I have been told I can use my camera to tell the machine if a strike has occurred...I have multiple repeat issues that would be cured with this mod...from what i understand, i can plug into the side of my zot 6525 chassic, and wire into the quibica L-com box...can you tell me where that is? is it in the pedestal computer?
    this fix sounds too good to be true, but i think it actually is.....eliminating all 10 micro switches on each machine! input is greatly appreciated as always!

  • #2
    You will need a XLMP for each pair of lanes this is wired into L comm you will also need a interface cable from the Zot chassis to the XLMP this will allow you to eliminate the K&L(26&27)in the jbox the cables are 6 wires only 3 are used for amf scoring the other 3 are used for Brunswick scoring you should be able to get them from zot


    • #3
      but where will I find the L comm? and whats an XLMP? thanks!


      • #4
        We use qubica scoring. The xlmp is hooked up like they said to our control box for the scoring and to the side of the chassis with a cut phone cord. RJ9 I think they are.

        Hope those pictures give you an idea. But that allows the camera to run the strike cycle so all the respot wiring isn't needed.


        • #5
          I have the same qubica box...but I only have one L the last pair of lanes...the others only have the qubica box... L Comm.jpg plus it looks a bit different than the pic in my I missing something?


          • #6
            I will say you have a lot more wires going in there than I do. I can open that up and see what it says but I'm not back in until Tuesday.

            I don't even have a book for any of the quibca stuff unfortunately. Thankfully haven't ever had a single problem with any of it besides a dead camera board. From March 1999 we had 1 pair of lanes with that Xlmp, only finally convinced the boss to get 5 more last year so we could bypass all those pain in the ass switches.


            • #7
              feeling some pressure, as leagues start up next week....I have one pair with strike cycle issues...they are different issues, but both would be fixed if I can make this mod happen....would love to do all four pairs...should there be an L Comm for each pair? I have a wiring diagram showing the place to hook in the red, yellow, and white wires, but only the one L Comm at the last pair...ive been told how easy it is to make this change, but it appears my place is wired differently...perhaps an older setup....I have heard VDB spoken a few times...Boss also...qubica pedistals with color crt monitors...more input is welcomed, thanks!


              • #8
                I have no idea what L Comm even is, unless that the top set of doubled wires going into that XLMP.

                It was might easy, hardest part was running the cord to the chassis.

                The VDB is the computer that is between the 2 monitors cabinets. We have CRT monitors as well.


                • #9
                  First off...disclaimer. I am not a Qubica scoring expert so the following information is as is an up for correction. However, you seem to be struggling so I'll kick in my nickles worth.

                  Your first question. " i can plug into the side of my zot 6525 chassic, and wire into the quibica L-com box...can you tell me where that is? is it in the pedestal computer?"

                  There is no L-com box. L-com is the networking that connects the scoring devices together. If you think of your home network (wired not wireless) you have a router, computer, maybe printer and network cable. These all run on the ethernet protocol. There is no ethernet device. All the individual devices are ethernet compatible but none of them are an ethernet device. Similarly with L-com there is no L-com box. You have L-com devices but no box. Your VDB, camera XLMP if equipped, bumper control unit (BCU) if equipped as well as others are all L-com devices that connect to the L-com network.

                  With regards to Chuck's response that you need an XLMP, it is my understanding that this is camera dependent. If you have the Qvision camera then the chassis connects directly to the camera board because Qvision has the XLMP built into it. If you don't have the Qvision, then you need the XLMP. The XLMP converts the L-com instructions into data, sync and ground signals to send the information to the chassis. The XLMP can be seen in the second photo posted by Artwebb. The XLMP works kind of like an interpreter helping two people speaking different languages understand each other.

                  In post number 3 you asked. "but where will I find the L comm? and whats an XLMP? thanks!"

                  I answered the second part in the paragraph above. As stated previously there is no L-com to find. If you have VDB's (you haven't committed to saying for sure you have these yet) then on the back side of the VDB there will be a connector labeled L-com. Similarly, each L-com device will have an L-com connector that the L-com cable will connect to. L-com is a four wire system. The outside two wires are power and ground for the other devices on the network and this power is generated from the VDB. The inner two wires are for bi-directional data transfer. While there is protection build in for these boards, if you wire them incorrectly, you can blow out the boards so always check your wiring before powering the system up and always shut the VDB down when altering the wiring. I can give you the wiring layout of the L-com if you need it.

                  I don't see the XLMP in your picture of your setup. The board on the bottom of the picture appears to be a bumper interface. Is this correct. You probably have L-com running to that board and likely comes from the camera. Depending on your setup, your L-com network likely originates at the VDB and goes to the camera, It would then go to keyboards and or bumpers but you can trace it through to identify each of your components to verify if you have the XLMP or not. If you haven't haven't has short cycle strike hooked up before then it's not likely that you have the XLMP because I don't think it's used for anything except the chassis interface and so then why would you have it if it was never interfaced. The signal from the XLMP is only for the pin count information and the cycle, machine on/off are still handled through your existing setup so they are two different systems.

                  If you don't have the XLMP then you will need one per pair of lanes provided you don't have the Qvision camera which has the XLMP build into it. The L-com would double up (one set of four wires for in and one set of four wires for out to the next device) as seen in the top connector in Artwebb's second picture. In the lower left of Artwebb's picture you see six wires. Three of these are for the left machine and the other three are for the right machine. These groups of three wires are what would go to the chassis expansion card. If you do have the bumper control unit (BCU) installed and if it is tied into the L-com, then you can tie your L-com for the XLMP from this point. We would need more information on this setup to help you decide this.

                  So far most of the conversation has focused on the scoring side of the interface. However, your chassis must also be capable of receiving the signal from the XLMP. I don't believe the older ZOT 6525 chassis had the expansion board installed by default. This was an optional feature. Whether the newer chassis has it installed by default I couldn't say. In either case you should confirm that your chassis has this capability prior to spending money for XLMP boards to interface them. I think you said above you knew where the wires went on the chassis so can you clarify a little further how you know this is the location for interfacing the scoring to the chassis.

                  So I think I've answered all I can at this point without further information. Anyone feel free to correct me if I'm incorrect somewhere as I don't want to provide bad information. Basically to summarize, if you don't have the Qvision camera's then you need the XLMP for each pair of machines. This will tie into the L-com network and convert the data to the signal the chassis needs and can understand. You then provide a three wire cable to each chassis tied to the lower left connector on the XLMP. This sends the chassis the signal it understands. ADDITIONAL NOTE: once you have the hardware installed, I believe you need to go into the setup and change a parameter to tell the scoring you are using the XLMP so it will then send the appropriate data to the XLMP otherwise the change won't work.

                  Hope this helps some. A list of your equipment would help but it should be fairly straight forward. It would definitely be helpful to know if you are using the Qvision camera or not as this would determine if you need the XLMP or not. Please let us know how else we can help you out.


                  • #10
                    Awesome I know why only 7&8 have what I thought was the L's for the bumpers, which are only on that pair...I have stationary cameras . The bumpers and scorers were installed together, probably at the same time as the chassis. ..the amf guy I spoke with told me if my chassis has the phone jack input on the side, then I just need the cord to wire into the L chassis book has a simple wiring diagram showing the L Comm as looking like the bumper interface. ..I don't know if my camera is the one you mentioned, but my gut tells me my "L Comm" is at the camera...all I need to do is have the camera tell the chassis when there's a strike....again thanks for the great info, I feel like I have a better grasp...will be there later to look into this more......


                    • #11
                      I put together various pictures showing the different components you are looking at to help clarify what you may have.

                      The first pic is the Q-vision camera. If you have this camera then pic two shows the location of the L-com connector outlined in the green box. The red box outline shows where your chassis would tie into. In this case it shows the connection going to the MP chassis.

                      Pic three shows what the T-vision and M-vision cameras look like.

                      Pic four shows the BCU which is what you have in the bottom of the picture you posted. This is for your bumpers. Pic five shows the connection of the BCU. The four wires on the left are the L-com connections. You can look at your BCU and trace where the L-com is coming from and if it goes anywhere else after this. As you can see, the BCU and XLMP do look similar but they are different and have different connectors.

                      Pic six shows the XLMP. If you don't have the Q-vision then you need one of these per lane pair. The large connector in the center at the top is the L-com connector. If this is the end of the line then you would only have 4 wires into this connector. If your L-com goes onto another device after this one then you will have 2 wires in each terminal for a total of 8 wires. The connection on the lower left is where you tie your chassis into. Three for the left machine and three for the right.

                      The silver box in your picture is either the F-box or Six-box depending on which you have. The F-box has more capabilities and so it has more connections. Pic seven shows a comparison of the two boxes. In either case, the L-com ties into the center of the board. In this case they have provided a terminal connection for each wire coming in and each wire going out as apposed to the XLMP where you would have to double up the wires in each terminal.

                      You don't have to run a new line from the camera to the curtain wall to get L-com there. You already have L-com in the F-box/Six-box setup. You can tap into it there and run to your XLMP.
                      Attached Files


                      • #12
                        more great stuff! it would appear that I have the tvision/mvision camera in the upper right...never heard six box spoken, but perhaps theres an f box...might be the black box at the bottom of my earlier picture, but I don't see any connectors, just wires and a transformer(?)...the other box is by the sweep, the (P?)...haven't found the connections in your last pictures yet, but will continue looking....the connector on the camera board has two sets of wires, one each going to the chassis, the other to the pedestal...I think....I need to follow the wires to the place they are wired in...perhaps that will be the fbox, or Lcomm or xlmp…..


                        • #13
                          In the picture you posted, the silver box with the word Qubica across the front of it is either a Six-box or F-box. (see picture below for reference) If you remove the lower cover on the box, you should find one of the two wiring configurations shown in the last picture I posted above. Match up the configuration in your box to one of the terminal layouts I posted and this will tell you if you have the F-box or the Six-box. This box provides the interface between your scoring and the machine controlling such things as power, cycle, etc and relaying information like foul and 2nd ball light status to the scoring system. It is the machine interface for the scoring to the pinspotter.

                          The black box is just a junction box they are apparently using to house a transformer. If that's all that's in it then the transformer may be providing the power for the pneumatic solenoids that control your lane bumpers. If that's the case you should see the low voltage wiring from the transformer go to the bumper control board (the board above the BCU in the bottom of your picture). It may also feed something else, I'm just guessing here based on the proximity of the black box to the BCU and bumper control board and since I can't see where your wires are going I can't say for sure what that transformer supplies.

                          Once again, there is no L-com box to find. You have L-com devices connected together by the L-com cabling. The 4 wire cable connected to the left four terminals on the BCU is an L-com cable. The BCU is an L-com device. When you open up the F-box or Six-box to determine which of these boxes you have, you will see one or two more L-com cables connected to the center terminals as shown in the last picture I posted above. The F-box or Six-box is another L-com device but it is not L-com. L-com is the network joining all the devices together and providing the means for them to communicate. The cable also is not L-com but simply another component of the L-com network.

                          I really doubt that you fill find an XLMP. If you had an XLMP then you would already be interfaced to the chassis and scoring and this upgrade would not be needed. Since the XLMP only serves to convert the scoring data to the necessary serial protocol to feed the chassis, it stands to reason that if you had and XLMP then it would be hooked up already. So, don't expect to find an XLMP unless it's setting in a drawer somewhere because nobody ever installed it. Since you don't have the Q-vision, you will need to buy XLMP devices and that will be an expense.

                          Hope this helps to clear up a few more of your questions.
                          Attached Files


                          • #14
                            heres a couple pics of the insides of my qubica box...something tells me I am in over my head...and probably out of financial range for now....I need to reassemble things, and see if I can find the failures on the one doesn't see strikes, even though all wires are connected at the switches, and the switches all test out okay....must be a wire in the harness running around the table...the other just occasionally doesn't tell the solenoid to shift, resulting in a second load of the table...doesn't always happen, happens more if strikes happen more...all wires and switches test okay, however, the #4 light pops on occasionally at random times....thinking this is a similar failure, that the voltage change prevents the sending of the strike signal...let me know what you see, and what I could/should do next...leagues start Thursday...cant tell you enough how much I appreciate everyones help! good luck to all in the coming season!
                            Attached Files


                            • #15
                              Make sure you check the L & K wires on the table wiring. Those must have continuity for the strike cycle to work.

                              Luckily when the Qubica system was installed by Sergio and the guys from Italy they put in one set of lanes with the XLMP. So once I finally convinced the boss to get the 5 others I just followed when they had already did. Since there was never any wiring diagrams left for us.

                              That is the same qubica box I posted. It was quite simple to add the xlmp tho.


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