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machine cycles when gutter thrown on opposite lane

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  • machine cycles when gutter thrown on opposite lane

    Gutter ball hits by ball detector lane 6 lane 5 cycles. Told to use bigger reflectors. Cannot find bigger we have 3 inch. Everything tight & lined up lights flashing super fast??

  • #2
    What kind of ball detector is this- who makes it? Got a pic?

    Sounds like it could be a couple of things but I would like to know what detector it is first, from your description it sounds like the AMF little black box one. Is this correct?

    If crosstalk is happening bigger reflectors won't help, actually, they could even make it worse.

    Well here it is anyway.

    Assuming the reflectors and detector are tight and not damaged, it seems to be more of an alignment issue. What can happen with these is if they are not set properly they can create crosstalk, where a ball thrown on one lane cycles both. This happens because the detector beam or beams are crossing both lanes and one signal is being seen by both detectors. One way to verify this is with the machines LOTO, take the cover off the detector and use something big like a dark colored binder or something, and completely block the beam on lane 6 while CAREFULLY watching the alignment LED on lane 5, do this several times and if there is ANY change at all in the pattern the LED is blinking then that means there is crosstalk going on. As per the install instructions, this is one way to fix that.

    -Take a piece of string or thin wire long enough to span across both lanes completely

    -Tape one end to the FRONT of the reflector bracket on one lane then run it across and do the same on the other, make sure it is tight

    -Then loosen the screws in the detector bracket and slide the unit forward until it just touches the string and position it so the string runs evenly across the front, then tighten down and re adjust the alignment

    What this does it it positions the detector in the middle of the beams to block them from crossing. But sometimes it still happens so what I did when we had these here is cut a piece of cardboard to slip over the detector and cut it big enough that it extended behind, up, and in front of it about 2-3" so that there was no way the beams could cross, I even colored it black. Yeah it was kind of hokey but it worked real well and I had no problem doing this because it stopped the sweeps from getting nailed, which, on a 30, can be a lot worse that a 70.
    Last edited by Tablejam; 10-28-2013, 03:49 PM.

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    • #3
      I've also seen this happen when the AMF detector head is mounted solid on the nose of the kickback, and in mode '0'. The vibration of the kickback seems to jolt the electronics enough to cause cycling when a beam is not broken.
      The last 72 lanes I installed, I mounted the trigger head on a piece of 1/2" plywood. The plywood has 2 layers of 2 sided foam tape (2 on each side) holding the plywood to the kickbacks. There is a single screw into the kickbacks, but it's not tightened to pull the plywood down, only to hold the plywood in place if the tape lets go. So the holes in the plywood for the mounting screws are large enough so there is no grip on the screw.

      trigger1.jpgtrigger2.jpgtrigger3.jpgtrigger4.jpg
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      This post is not an unpaid promotion of my business.

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      • #4
        I have Zot triggering at my center and I did something similar. I added a 2x4 between the kickbacks and mounted the emitters on the 2x4. Giving good results here.
        Gene Simmons for president!!!

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        • #5
          That's brilliant Ted.
          I really enjoy the Simpsons. My problem is that I am starting to look like Homer. Doh!!!

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          • #6
            I probably should not have thrown away those 16 lanes worth of AMF triggering. Bowltronics almost never has an issue.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by SVLFever View Post
              That's brilliant Ted.
              I don't know about brilliant, but it works. Steve Stafford had made mountings that were actually anchored to the concrete and extended up between the kickbacks to mount them, which guarantees there will never be vibration.
              Thx for the words John.
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              This post is not an unpaid promotion of my business.

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              • #8
                Thanks for sharing this problem. We developed this recently on two of sets of lanes. It turns out that we needed to tighten down the mounts on the kickbacks.

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