changing oil?

[harleymama]

Hi. Has anyone been having problems this season with Kegel HV lane oil?
We seem to be having alot of problems this year that we have never had before. It gelled up in our machine, and lanes are very inconsistant. Last year(s), we used the same exact pattern, oil, stripper, bowlers, everything and had numerous honor scores. This year we haven't had a single one.

We keep the lane machine clean, keep the oil in a warm location, shake it to mix.....all the things we are supposed to do. I complained to Kegel, they said there were no complaints/problems but sent me a free case of oil.
We have wood lanes with the guardian and image overlay 24 feet.

I'm contemplating changing to a Brunswick oil, but I'm very nervous to do it mid-season. We are talking about changing for the summer, but I'm afraid to wait.

How different will an oil change be to my current pattern? Extreme or not so much?

Thanks for any thoughts!

[8270king]

What Kegel oil are you using?

Maybe a switch to one of their other oils would help.

[harleymama]

Their Offense High Viscocity.
If we change, I'd like to get away from the whole idea of having to keep them "shaken & mixed".

[8270king]

All lane oils have a recipe - ingredients mixed together...there is settling in all of them.

I have not had any issues with Kegel's Prodigy oil.

[harleymama]

Thank you for your help.

Has anyone else out there made a complete switch in brands?
If so, how dramatic was the change?

[Mechanick]

Thank you for your help.

Has anyone else out there made a complete switch in brands?
If so, how dramatic was the change?

One thing I do like about the Brunswick oil is that they do not seperate like the Kegel ones tend to. When I switched from Kegel to Brunswick, there was thick stuff at the bottom of the oil tank that was also clogging the oil filter. When oil is in the jug, its easy to shake and mix it up....but how do you mix up the oil in the oil tank? This does not happen with the Brunswick oil. I was using Infinity, and switched to connect in a kustodian Ion. They are both good oils. I still do give the connect a shake before I fill the kustodian even though I don't really think I need to, I guess its habit now.

[NeverSeenThat]

When oil is in the jug, its easy to shake and mix it up....but how do you mix up the oil in the oil tank?

You mean you can't shake your machine??? Seriously, Prodigy seems to have far fewer separation problems than some of their other oils. The only question will be if Prodigy is slick enough and last long enough for a high friction surface. On the plus side, Prodigy will not cause carrydown and machine issues so you can apply more volume. Let King do his tweak for Prodigy and you should escape the change with minimal backlash. I would delay any major changes until summer when you have a chance to better evaluate it.

[harleymama]

That's the exact situation we are having with our oil tank, thus the clogged filter and inconsistant oil placement.

Did you have to change the oil pattern after you changed to the Brunswick oil?

[Mechanick]

Yes, I had to play with my pattern to get it like I wanted it....I would say to wait until after the season is done to do any major changes....but if the general concensus is that the lanes really suck this year, and the scores are backing that up, then maybe a change would not be that terrible of a thing in the eyes of the bowlers.

[harleymama]

Thanks! I really appreciate your thoughts.

[rivmike]

One of the worst yrs. I have ever had, ( modern era sanction machines ) I changed to bruns logic from amf utopia and not have alot of success. That being said,we have not had a winter. So I always have problems in oct.( damp) and that is what we have had in oct.-feb. !!!!! Not to blame it all on the weather but bowler like cold.( lanes more consistent, pins fly better, not thinking about golf.)

[Jan-Willem]

I allmost used the past 12 years Kegel oil, first the HV in a phoenix-S, later prodigy switched to Kustodian always cleaning the oil tank 3 times a season with thick oil in the oil tank, once even clogged the display line witch shows how full the tank is. When Navigate and Kegel did their tour I visited the Seminar and start using the Navigate lane conditioner (my opinion the best oil they ever brought) Still the seperation in the oil tank so still cleaning the tank 3 times a season. I started this season with thinking lets give Brunswick a shot again they put a lot of effort in their production and research in their oils (IMO think throwbot). So it can't be bad !! In the past once tried Control with not that good result few years ago. Maybe it was the state of the wooden lanes compared with the choosen and tweaked pattern so give up and returned after a few months to Navigate. But as I was telling started this season with the authority22 lane conditioner with VERY good results. The authority lane conditioner is in viscosity much thinner (22) than Navigate (29) but wanted to find out I dont put to much conditioner compared to the navigate conditioner that the ball wouldn't react in the first part of the lane. (To much oil could end up in soon reaction of the ball because the ball has to swim threw thick oil) The Brunswick Connect Lane conditioner has a viscosity of 33. It was obviously that the front parts of the lanes where to fast dry with 2 competitions after each other with the authority. So connect was the next logical step for me.The scores where already higher and much important steadier than seasons before. So a good pattern in combination with the Connect lane conditioner is a winning season for me as a mechanic. Never had a silent season (less complaints) as this I even on request of the owner and the leadership of the local association I even reschedule the recoat this season from oktober to 19 februari this month. Lets see what happens after that. I recoat during season because of summer league twice a week and finals and during season just 2 weeks before events.

Almost forgot to mention the Brunswick oil don't need to be shaken I think but still do

[shamefowjze]

Your issue with the Offense may have been that it froze, or close to it. Manufacturers have no control over how their products are stored at a distributors warehouse or in a freight/delivery truck. Most oils are not as sensitive to this as HV is, but if the oil is warmed the oil will mix back together. Some of the older kegel oils did/do have a tendacy to seperate and once the product was shaken, it would be fine. I would advise you shake any oil you put in your machine. The UV content is not very soluable and tends to fall out pretty easily.

But to answer your original question, it's not a matter of switching from Kegel to Brunswick that dictacts a pattern adjustment. It depends on what oil you're switching from and to what. It's the characteristics of the oil thats important, not the manufacturer. But if things are as bad as you claim, then the extra work of getting a pattern dialed in would be far easier than dealing with bitching bowlers.

Watch the ball reaction. Most bowlers are uneducated and only watch their ball at the arrows and at the pins. They may claim the ball isn't hooking when they get it outside, when in fact it's rolling out. So they are unintentionally lying to you. The ball will not. Physics is physics. It doesn't care about scores, egos, kegel, or Brunswick.

If you are unable to know what changes to make based off of ball reaction, I suggest you call in a proffesional.

[MASTERMIKE]

Your issue with the Offense may have been that it froze, or close to it. Manufacturers have no control over how their products are stored at a distributors warehouse or in a freight/delivery truck. Most oils are not as sensitive to this as HV is, but if the oil is warmed the oil will mix back together. Some of the older kegel oils did/do have a tendacy to seperate and once the product was shaken, it would be fine. I would advise you shake any oil you put in your machine. The UV content is not very soluable and tends to fall out pretty easily.

But to answer your original question, it's not a matter of switching from Kegel to Brunswick that dictacts a pattern adjustment. It depends on what oil you're switching from and to what. It's the characteristics of the oil thats important, not the manufacturer. But if things are as bad as you claim, then the extra work of getting a pattern dialed in would be far easier than dealing with bitching bowlers.

Watch the ball reaction. Most bowlers are uneducated and only watch their ball at the arrows and at the pins. They may claim the ball isn't hooking when they get it outside, when in fact it's rolling out. So they are unintentionally lying to you. The ball will not. Physics is physics. It doesn't care about scores, egos, kegel, or Brunswick.

If you are unable to know what changes to make based off of ball reaction, I suggest you call in a proffesional.

GREAT POST.........

Mike

[shamefowjze]

I forgot to add that my above post is "assuming" everything is working correctly with your machine.