Auto-cycle has me stumped

[Knightshades]

Lane 10, 82-70, Bowland X (Conqueror), 5 board chassis's mod. to MP & expansion board for fast strike, six box, VDB. Now that you know what I run. Machine auto-cycles after a strike BUT only after the machine has to wait for the 9 pin. For example: 2 bowlers back to back strikes, machine sits w/sweep in second guard waiting for the bins to fill, sets a rack and immediately drops the sweep to first guard and feels for pins. I've swapped chassis's, VDB, expansion and MK-70 boards, tested all cam switches with C2a tester. I can't find anything. Please help.

[Knightshades]

small update, I talked to stahl's and Jamie said he's heard of this but never seen it. Not a good sign, he thought maybe the grey wire from the T1 for instructomat. Removed and didn't change anything so I put it back

[Grit]

not trying to nitpick but you meant T2 transformer not T1 with the grey wire correct?

Have you swapped the 6/Fbox?

[Knightshades]

No I haven't changed the 6box yet that was my next but I don't have a spare working on that.

[Knightshades]

What about the XLMP interface. Could that cause this?

[BillyT4QAMF]

What about the XLMP interface. Could that cause this?

Well if this only happens on a strike cycle and you have swapped the chassis and board, the XLMP is responsible for sending the signals that cause the machine to perform the strike cycle. I don't see how it would do what you are saying, but it's easy enough to SWAP (don't replace) to see if the problem moves.

Now that I'm thinking about it, have you tried to copy the settings from a working lane to this one?

[Knightshades]

Well if this only happens on a strike cycle and you have swapped the chassis and board, the XLMP is responsible for sending the signals that cause the machine to perform the strike cycle. I don't see how it would do what you are saying, but it's easy enough to SWAP (don't replace) to see if the problem moves.

Now that I'm thinking about it, have you tried to copy the settings from a working lane to this one?

I have copied setting, I'l try swapping the XLMP with 7 & 8 see what happens. Here's something weird, Since I've posted this Lane 10 has quit doing this. Don't know if I should still swap or wait to see if it starts doing it again.

[Tablejam]

Sounds like it may be getting a signal to cycle. Are the ball detectors at the camera both aligned and are these the only ball detectors used to start the cycle? It seems to me that something is 'timing out' and when it has to wait for the nine the time out happens causing it to cycle again, strange but not sure exactly what would cause that. If swapping the chassis, boards, and I guess XLMP to different lanes does not stop it then it must be something going on with that machine or scoring.

Let me ask this.... when it waits for the nine then spots pins, when the sweep goes up to home does it stop or pause before dropping back down or does it run up past zero without even stopping then go back down to guard and does the sweep coast? Crazy but if it coasts from zero far enough to lift SB that will start the time delay which will finish the cycle.

[Knightshades]

Sounds like it may be getting a signal to cycle. Are the ball detectors at the camera both aligned and are these the only ball detectors used to start the cycle? It seems to me that something is 'timing out' and when it has to wait for the nine the time out happens causing it to cycle again, strange but not sure exactly what would cause that. If swapping the chassis, boards, and I guess XLMP to different lanes does not stop it then it must be something going on with that machine or scoring.

Let me ask this.... when it waits for the nine then spots pins, when the sweep goes up to home does it stop or pause before dropping back down or does it run up past zero without even stopping then go back down to guard and does the sweep coast? Crazy but if it coasts from zero far enough to lift SB that will start the time delay which will finish the cycle.

Sweep doesn't stop at zero runs straight through to first guard. I thought the sweep might be coasting to so I also change the sweep motor and replaced it with a stahl's combo, (relayed with the box, no points) not coasting at all. But again Lane 10 hasn't done it since sunday, hard to figure it out if it's not doing it anymore. I always knew these machines had minds of there own sometimes, must have gotten mad at me cause I had to get help, I'll post again as soon as I see it again.

[Tablejam]

Alright not stopping at zero. That indicates to me anyway that the machine is getting a cycle signal at the end of spotting in the current cycle and holds it long enough to continue and start another cycle. Not sure what in the scoring would cause this. Could there be an intermittent short in any of the circuits that start a cycle?

Just out of curiosity if you go into setup...technical setup... pinsetter and camera (this should be correct for bowland) if there is a setting for CYCLE TIME or RESET TIME what is it set for? I believe the default is 14. Well since the initial impulse to cycle the machine comes from the ball detectors/camera I wonder if the camera T Vision board is goofy or if there is a funky connection there.

When it cycles again is it also scoring?

Are the cycle connections in the a&mc box solid?

Hmm, this is a good one. Im still thinking something is telling it to cycle. What about disconnecting all the things and insulating them that can cycle the machine except the sixbox connection.

[lafarge jr]

ok heres what ive seen before. same symtoms as you have but mine would wait for like an hour in to league before it would happen. what we found out was the boards in the chassis were causing the problem. something would discharge and it would cycle ramdomly out of the blue. we did all kinds of things and it was ultimatly the baosrd in the chassis. we had expanders from omega tech and we had some creative teck boards. all our problems stemed from the creative tech board and had no problem on the omega tech boardss. we chased our tail for like three weeks trying all kinds of things.

[Knightshades]

OK, it was logged last night on lane 10, started up again, did it at least three times time to start messing with things again. Any more ideas will help. Please check all the posts to see whats already been done. Everything suggested has been tried. Switching the XLMP it quit for almost two weeks, it's back on the same lane. I'll be changing the sixbox next.

[Knightshades]

ok heres what ive seen before. same symtoms as you have but mine would wait for like an hour in to league before it would happen. what we found out was the boards in the chassis were causing the problem. something would discharge and it would cycle ramdomly out of the blue. we did all kinds of things and it was ultimatly the baosrd in the chassis. we had expanders from omega tech and we had some creative teck boards. all our problems stemed from the creative tech board and had no problem on the omega tech boardss. we chased our tail for like three weeks trying all kinds of things.

I believe all our mk-70 boards are omega-tek