Wierd Stuff

I have a 82-70 with mp chassis. The machine will run good for a couple of days then when you turn off the machine and turn it back on the back-end motor runs backwards. You cant use the chassis or the control box in the back to do anything. I have changed complete chassis off of another working machine and put that chassis on the other machine still have the same problem, so I know it isnt in the chassis. I have checked all the c-1 plugs they seem to be ok. I have also replaced all of the switches in the control box. It seems when we finally get it going the machines goes into like shadow bowling no table or sweep, but the pit runs. You unplug the main power from the machine and plug it back it the pit runs backwards. I have also changed the back-end motor. It just seems to come and go. But it only happens when the machine is cut off and then back on.

Thanks for your help

[SVLFever]

Re: Wierd Stuff

I know you might have checked this, but, are you sure it's not the clutch in the ball lift???

Sometimes the clutch fails and it's starts running off the other lane's power (which runs the ball lift with the other drive, which transfers through the bad clutch) hence, the wrong direction.

Fever [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/usflag.jpg[/img]

Re: Wierd Stuff

I have all the belts off except for the pinwheel belt just so I can run it with a little bit of a load on it. Some where I think I am getting a ground on backend wires or something

[TheGMan143]

Re: Wierd Stuff

If the chassis is acting up, you can try interchanging it with a known-good one and see if the problem follows the chassis or stays with the machine. Just be very careful... with a weird problem that may involve line voltage, take every precaution that the machine is well-grounded, and that you are very conscious of where you are putting your hands... even if there's NOT supposed to be voltage in an area, always assume that there IS. It'll help to keep you from inadvertently being knocked on your a$$ (or worse) by power that's going somewhere that it shouldn't be.

Try disconnecting the backend motor and running the machine without it... since that backend motor is ONLY powered, and not controlled, by the chassis... it may well be that the backend motor is also causing the rest of the problems. If it's backfeeding power to the chassis or wireway ground, or causing a partial short (voltage drop) in the machine, it could cause the machine to act erratically.

In terms of the backend motor problem, I've never seen something like that on a bowling machine, but I have seen it in industrial equipment... certain AC motors are reversible, or can become so if the wiring or the windings become bridged, the motor can be made to run in reverse... depending on where the rotor stops in relation to the stator determines which direction the magnetic field will pull it on the next start. 220V motors seem to be more susceptible to a problem like this than the 110V motors are, but it can still happen.

Disconnect everything from the gearbox (distributor, wheel belt, and lift drive), and make a 'cheater' plug for the backend motor if you don't have one (I'm going to assume that your motors are 110V...put a 3-prong service cord on to a backend motor plug so you can plug it into the outlets at the back of the machine). Start and stop the backend motor with it... if it starts running backwards at any time, the stator may have bridged windings... pull the mtr/gbx and install a spare.

There's nothing in the machine or chassis that could change the rotation of the backend motor... it's self-contained... all it's electrics stay with the motor (unlike the T/S motors which have external caps and reversing circuitry) All the chassis does is turn it on and off through a relay.

[Rep]

Re: Wierd Stuff

I've actually seen this 2 different times. One time one of the angles in the pit broke off and jammed by the front roller, somehow when you turned it on, it gave the motor a little bump backwards and for some reason it started that way, the obvious klanging gave that away. The other time was fried wires and a bad switch in the motor, I didn't fix it so I dunno what exactly was bad where but it was quite interesting to read in the call book to say the least lol. Definately an oddball problem, good luck fixing it. BTW "G" I know you have nationals at hour house, do you have National BE's too? We do, got the best cheater cord ever. The 2 prongs on the BE's fit perfectly in a coffee pot plug lol [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

[TheGMan143]

Re: Wierd Stuff

Originally posted by Rep:
BTW "G" I know you have nationals at hour house, do you have National BE's too? We do, got the best cheater cord ever. The 2 prongs on the BE's fit perfectly in a coffee pot plug lol [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yea, our machines are 100% Nationals.

I didn't want to say that in my last post... you're right, though... they do fit. Two of ours are electric frying pan plugs. [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

[Rep]

Re: Wierd Stuff

Originally posted by TheGMan143:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Rep:
BTW "G" I know you have nationals at hour house, do you have National BE's too? We do, got the best cheater cord ever. The 2 prongs on the BE's fit perfectly in a coffee pot plug lol [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yea, our machines are 100% Nationals.

I didn't want to say that in my last post... you're right, though... they do fit. Two of ours are electric frying pan plugs. [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img] </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">LOL G! Ours are all Nationals as well, hey if the plug fits I say use it [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

[KL Kevin]

Re: Wierd Stuff

So, G, how many minutes till a national is "well-done" ??? :p :p [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

[Rep]

Re: Wierd Stuff

Originally posted by KL Kevin:
So, G, how many minutes till a national is "well-done" ??? :p :p [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">LMAO!

[TheGMan143]

Re: Wierd Stuff

Originally posted by KL Kevin:
So, G, how many minutes till a national is "well-done" ??? :p [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hehe... I dunno... I'll have to plug one in some time and stick a fork into it to check. [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

The last time I had to take one apart, the shaft was seized into the collar on the gearbox... after cooking it with an acetylene torch for 15 minutes, it started to look "well done"... Seasoned it with a little Liquid Wrench, tenderized it with a mallet, and cooked it for 5 more minutes until it warped, then served it on a platter to the garbage can. [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/mad.gif[/img]

[Rep]

Re: Wierd Stuff

Originally posted by KL Kevin:
So, G, how many minutes till a national is "well-done" ??? :p :p [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img] [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I dunno about well done, but with ours once the water (coffee) stops dripping thru into the pot it's done [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif[/img] [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]