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  • National Motor Brushes

    Is anyone having problems with the carbon brushes that are in 82-70 table and sweep motors. We are seeing premature wear and carbon dust is being is being sprayed all over the inside top of the motor.
    While I have some of the electronic start switches, most of my motors still have the mechanical switches.
    The carbon dust lays on the bakelight, causing a dead short. When this happens, flames shoot out of the head of the motor.[Very interesting to watch.]
    I was told there is only one company making these brushes for all of the USA.
    I was also told by one bowling supplier at my local trade show that I am the only person that ever mentioned this problem.
    Any replies would be welcome.

  • #2
    Re: National Motor Brushes

    not had that problem yet but i have seen a few not many with the premature wear. nothing to extream though.

    scotty

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    • #3
      Re: National Motor Brushes

      Nothing too crazy here either, some wear faster than others but no flames lol
      All I want in life is to turn wrenches and climb around pinsetters/pinspotters again :/

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      • #4
        Re: National Motor Brushes

        Over the years I have seen the carbon dust build up inside the head of a motor , just blow it clean before it gets to be too much. When it gets to the extreme you are talking about ( actually shorting a circuit ), I believe it is referred to as "carbon ground".

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        • #5
          Re: National Motor Brushes

          Like I was saying, we never really have problems due to the dust. I leave it until I do change the brushes then I blow it all out, gives ya somewhat of an idea as to when they were last done (as our old mechanics sometimes didn't write work done down grrrrrrr) [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/mad.gif[/img] Naturally if it did cause trouble I'd clean it asap
          All I want in life is to turn wrenches and climb around pinsetters/pinspotters again :/

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          • #6
            Re: National Motor Brushes

            Vantage makes them. I just bought some from Celucoat.
            I was working at another center the other day and was working on a sweep with a national motor. Two times when I plugged it back in to return it to home from 2nd guard, it shot sparks out and blew the breaker on the wall. Worked fine other than that. Maybe related to the problem you describe? My national motor knowledge is very limited, but dug into them here recently to learn a bit.
            Charley
            82-70's SS Chassis Omega-Tek w/expanders
            2009 Qubica scoring 3QT's and 6 box.

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            • #7
              Re: National Motor Brushes

              The only thing I can think of that would cause the brushes to grind off like that would be a rough surface on the plate, excessive pressure on the brushes from having replacement springs installed that were too long/too thick, or oil fouling in the brushes that caused them to soften.

              Never saw anything like that... when I take a motor apart, there's a fine residue of grey dust on the inside of the housing, but little or no 'loose' dust laying in the motor.

              I'm not sure where they were purchased from, but our old mechanic bought long 'sticks' of carbon brush material (about 9" long, 1/4" diameter maybe?) from a local supplier... I just used a very fine coping saw blade to cut off new brushes at the correct length from the long piece of stock. Haven't had to use much since we went thru and rebuilt the motor heads... the ones we originally installed are still going strong, and some of them are pushing 10 yrs. old or more.

              For cleaning dust and crud out of the motor, we've had very good luck with ECG Electronics Wash, or GUNK Electric Motor Cleaner. I'm more partial to the ECG stuff... it smells a heck of a lot nicer, but they both work good.
              <span style="font-style: italic">Educatio est omnium efficacissima forma rebellionis</span>

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              • #8
                Re: National Motor Brushes

                I smell a new idea for the enviro-bushing company [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img] I wonder how they'd hold up if you made them out of that material, or if they'd even work.

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                • #9
                  Re: National Motor Brushes

                  MELT!!!!!!!!!!!! get a wick and you can build an enviro-candle.

                  Haven't purchased brushes for a couple years. As G-Man saidcheck your plate for a burr or divit.

                  May be the beginning of a bad batch.

                  Maybe one of your guys put a flint in one of the brush ports. [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]
                  Pinspotters do not break down when they are not running!

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                  • #10
                    Re: National Motor Brushes

                    Many Japanese centres were having the problem described. Basically, the brushes were a bit soft and wearing fairly quickly. They were cheap though, so I am told.

                    They replaced them with the genuine AMF brushes, somewhat more expensive, but problem solved. I'm glad I wasn't paying the bill though, 1,200 brushes were replaced in one go across several centres.

                    Ray
                    Ray Jordan
                    Cybernetic Solutions/tenpintec
                    Australia

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                    • #11
                      Re: National Motor Brushes

                      Blow out all your motors with compressed air every month or 2 &amp; it'll solve your problem... and prevent several others too. You can do the chassis at the same time &amp; avoid problems there too.

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