AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

[wb8yjf]

Anyone out there got a schematic or a manual for the XL Radaray (p/n 612-460-020)? If so please email me at: wb8yjf@earthlink.net with details.

Thanks!
Jon [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/usflag.jpg[/img]

[TheGMan143]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

XL Radaray?

Not sure... I have the manual for the 82-120 Radaray, and somewhere around here I think I still have the one for the 82-08 units. Never heard of an XL radaray

[felix]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

Radaray Plus? #610-460-901 [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif[/img] [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif[/img]
web page
Nope. Never seen one [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]
web page
web page

[wb8yjf]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

Nope, it is a XL Radaray. I thought the guy was talking about the Radaray plus, too. I picked this thing up at the center. It is similer to a plus unit BUT no relays, about 1/4 the size. 1st time I've ever seen these! Similer circuitry (except a lot of surface mount IC's), but designed to work with the XL 82-70 machine. The output of this thing is 12VDC & with the wire running to the back & the limited current it provides won't even pull in a relay. Since the 82-70's (MP chassis) needs 12 VAC, I guess I'm gonna have to design an opto coupled circuit to drive a couple of relays witha 12 VAC xfmr to supply the voltage. I would post a picture if I knew how to on this site. How do you do that?

Thanks!
Jon [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/usflag.jpg[/img]

[felix]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

:p [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

[wb8yjf]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

NPE, that ain't it! I'll do the pix thing in the AM. Maybe this thing is a rare bird! Beats me, but that isn't the unit I'm talking about. Weird bird, I guess?!

Leave it to AMF..HA

Tnx, guys!
Jon

[welby]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

I have e-mailed you the manual for the XL radaray. Hope this helps.

Ste.

[wb8yjf]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

I didn't get the email'd manual(?) Can you send it again (wb8yjf@earthlink.net)?
I send a couple of pics to a couple of guys, hopefully that will shed a little light on the thing. I did find out that this foul unit was specifically designed for the 82-70 XL. Guess I'll have to get to work on an interface (AMF doesn't have any kind of kit for that).

THANKS!
Jon [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/usflag.jpg[/img]

[TheGMan143]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

If you're trying to interface it to a non-XL machine, it shouldn't be too hard. If the output is very low amperage 12VDC and it won't drive a relay, I'll bet it will still drive a transistor or SCR trigger.

The 'adapter' could probably be as simple as a transistor being triggered by the foul unit, and the output either switching the machine's foul circuit directly, or amplifying it enough to drive a small component relay that you could connect to the machine foul circuit.

OR, you can just skip the adaptation stuff, rip out the proprietary units, and install Redlines... <a href="http://www.joystickscoring.com/reddes.html" target="_blank"><a href="http://www.joystickscoring.com/reddes.html" target="_blank"><a href="http://www.joystickscoring.com/reddes.html" target="_blank"><a href="http://www.joystickscoring.com/reddes.html" target="_blank"><a href="http://www.joystickscoring.com/reddes.html" target="_blank"><a href="http://www.joystickscoring.com/reddes.html" target="_blank"><a href="http://www.joystickscoring.com/reddes.html" target="_blank"><a href="http://www.joystickscoring.com/reddes.html" target="_blank"><a href="http://www.joystickscoring.com/reddes.html" target="_blank">http://www.joystickscoring.com/reddes.html</a></a></a></a></a></a></a></a></a>

[wb8yjf]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

Yea, I agree rip the damn things out &amp; put in ones designed for 82-70 MP's. Kinda weird designing a completely different unit just for 1 type of machine. I'm gonna play with a couple of different interfaces, one like you described with a transistor driver, the other using opto-couplers. I'll see which one is the best &amp; let u guys know (FYI).

Thanks!
Jon [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/usflag.jpg[/img]

[TheGMan143]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

Well...here's a pretty simple doubled circuit that will amplify a small input signal into one that will drive a relay coil... You may have to play around with the value of the resistor on the input to match your incoming signal voltage, but it just may do what you're looking for.



Pull the +12v off of the supply for the foul board electronics, and feed the trigger outputs from the foul board into the inputs on the adapter circuit... then connect your machine trigger power output through relay contacts.

If you're planning on using a transformer to drive 12VAC for the foul trigger circuit on the machine, you could probably supplement this circuit with a 12-15VAC transformer, a small rectifier and a couple of capacitors to create the power input for the circuit, then use the AC power ahead of the rectifier (with a resistor if needed to drop the voltage) from the same transformer to trigger the foul circuit through the relay contacts... That would pretty much make it a complete adapter package that could be installed on the maskwall... mains AC in to power the circuit and outputs, 2 inputs from the foul units, 2 outputs to the machines.

Seems like an awful big project... it may be easier to pull them and change them out instead of building one of these for each pair of lanes... If you're careful when pulling out the old units, you could probably sell them to an XL house for spares or upgrades and use the money to offset the cost of new foul units that will work with your machines. For that matter, it may even be worth it to pick up some decent used 82-120s or (better yet) some secondhand ZOT 82-120 infrared conversion units and the frames, rather than tackle building adapters for each pair.

Just a thought...

After looking over the pic of the unit above... if your unit is similar and it has those 3 little component relays on the board, an easier method may be to just isolate the relay contacts from the 2 machine relays (the third one probably drives the buzzer), feed in 12vac from a transformer through the relay contacts with a couple of carefully soldered wires, and send it out to the machines. One decent 12vac trasformer could probably supply a couple pairs with enough power to trigger the foul circuits. As they stand now, the relay contacts on the board are probably feeding from the circuit. Breaking the traces would give you the dry switch contacts you need to operate your machines. If the board doesn't have component relays on it(completely solid-state), the this trick won't work... the power is probably coming directly off of an SCR or one of the legs of the IC's... there's no way to isolate that.

[wb8yjf]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

Hey G-man, yea, I was tinkering around in my spare time (yea, right) and just about had it when they called &amp; needed the foul unit back (NO spares) for of all things, kids bowling! So, I don't have one now to play around with. There are no relays on this unit &amp; since I only had it for about 12 hours, never got a chance to do any reverse engineering on the circuit. I believe it is a logic output on the things, so the transistor drivers should work. I'm gonna bug them to swap the things out. This house is kinda weird, 20 XL's and the rest are MP chassis. They said the foul detectors were a part of the package. I don't know when I'll get a chance to mess with it again &amp; frankly don't want to anyway. I have plenty of stuff to keep me busy besides adapting a mis-matched foul detector to a different machine. Maybe during summer..nah, I'd rather be fishing! [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]
Tnx! Jon [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/usflag.jpg[/img]

[wb8yjf]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed



Weird lil buggers, huh?

[SVLFever]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

WB8YJF,

I believe that these units are installed in the new centers now. I believe they are designed to work only with XL pinspotters and are not designed to work with non-XL equipment.

I have only seen photos, and haven't seen them yet in real life. [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/shocked.gif[/img]

Fever [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/usflag.jpg[/img]

[wb8yjf]

Re: AMF XL Radaray manual/schematic needed

I believe you are right, Fever. I'm waiting for the center to decide if they want to go thru all the hassle of doing a modification or not. Oh well, I know what I'd do...PUNT! Get another type for the 70's and be done with it.

Thanks!
Jon [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/usflag.jpg[/img]