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  • kicker problem

    Before i start i would like to say amf cant send me a pbl so that is out of the question. i have akicker problem one time the ball will sit 3/4 the way in the ball door the next time it is throw the same ball it wont even get in the ball door. i have changed kickers and front segmant and its brackets rear filler pad its brackets the whole kicker assembly both lanes kicker belts starter pad and balllift and still same problem i have spent the last 4 days in this machine ask me anything i can answer any more questions you need to ask me to help me
    When in doubt check at bowl-tech
    When people are around no cursing and throwing things

  • #2
    Re: kicker problem

    Have you checked the drop of the B/L? If the B/L is too low, the ball can't get out.
    "Gun control is the policy of tyrants"
    Rep. Rob Bishop (R-UT)

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    • #3
      Re: kicker problem

      yes i placed a ball in the ball door lifted the ball lift and slowly let it down and stoped it when it just barely touched the ball. i am having the problem i cant get the kicker to grab the ball when it goes 3/4 the way it it will go up. i have chains on the kicker spring i dont know if you know of this. what else can i be missing
      When in doubt check at bowl-tech
      When people are around no cursing and throwing things

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: kicker problem

        MJS,
        Sounds like an oil problem to me.
        A good way to check any ball exit is to clean your up fron belt or wheel on top of a wheel, the BL belt and the kicker rollers. Go up front and throw ball after ball down the gutter only. After throwing about 50 balls down and you have no problem, send a few balls down the center of the lanes. Problems? Then it's the oil.

        We serviced a center that had kickers and had the same problem on a few of his machines. This is the only way we could convince the owner that he was using too much oil. Did he change his oiling procedure? NO! He is now out of business. Did ball return problems put him out of business? NO! But it was certainly a contributing factor!

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        • #5
          Re: kicker problem

          You might try shimming your kicker back a bit. Use something about 3/8" thick, like a scrap of old dist belt, between the kicker housing and the bumper on the rear filler plate. Also, check the starter pad assy for slop in the pivot bearings. When I had kickers, I had a bad one, which would not let the ball in very well on the even lane but worked fine on the odd lane.
          You might want to try a few different kicker designs. I used to like the red football ones, but some work well on some machines and others will not. If this does not work, ask more questions!!
          Gene Simmons for president!!!

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: kicker problem

            Tall Paul used this in our old center and it worked. Glue a 3" piece of distributor belt on the front segment, next to the starter pad. It seemed to help our problems with that situation.

            Tim
            HBOwner

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            • #7
              Re: kicker problem

              I have done what tall paul did. the one thing i can tell you guys to give you more info is the bounce plate is 1/2" higher than the ball door and yes the starter pad on 14 is sticking out a little more than on any lan but i cannot figure out how to get that stop on it to hold it backn any further. i dont know how familliar you guys are with the brackets that hold the front segment in place but the finger that sticks up towards the ball track had to be cut off to get it in to place the finger would not allow it to go back far enough. one more little tid bit of info is i can get it to work for so long and then is just stops working. oil is a problem but only with the new eagle glow house balls and some other resin balls with a shinny finish but all i do is take 360 grit sand paper to it and wet sand it a little bit and i never have a problem again. tell me how to get the starter pad to lean back a little more
              When in doubt check at bowl-tech
              When people are around no cursing and throwing things

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: kicker problem

                Take out the starter pad assembly out and bend the part that holds against the riser track tubes. Be careful when you remove it as the riser tubes must come off to and the one on the even (I think) side is the one with the pressure on it. Last one I removed, when I put it back in, I used about 2 or 3 zip ties to hold the pressure off so I could get the tubes back on, then cut the zip ties.
                Gene Simmons for president!!!

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                • #9
                  Re: kicker problem

                  cool i am goin to just replace that and see what happens because i dont want to play with this much anymore since monday i have 57 hours in this machine i see every scratch on lane 14's ball door in my sleep
                  When in doubt check at bowl-tech
                  When people are around no cursing and throwing things

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: kicker problem

                    Originally posted by toon30s:
                    Also, check the starter pad assy for slop in the pivot bearings.
                    <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I’m with toons on this one. If the ball is making ¾ of the way in, the wheels are doing their job. If not, try another wheel or shimming it back or in and out and trying different tensions.

                    One thing about the starter unit is that you can’t really tell if there is slop in the bushings or bracket, because of all the tension of the spring. I’ll bet if you disassemble it, you will find the bracket holes to be slotted and possibility of the long bolt has been worn by the bracket holes.

                    I would make sure that you have all the parts on hand before removing the start unit because it is a pain to pull and find these things bad (which will cause big problems) only to have to put back in defective and re-pull at a later time. If you find that after rebuilding it works better but still buggy…you can glue a little piece of carpet or distributor belt on the square part of the starter bracket…which will pull it back slightly.

                    Triac

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                    • #11
                      Re: kicker problem

                      oh cool triac i think that might do it i am taking a little time off until 5 i will try it and go at it again thanks i will keep you posted
                      When in doubt check at bowl-tech
                      When people are around no cursing and throwing things

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: kicker problem

                        MJS,
                        Is the ball that won't make it in the door one time and will get 3/4 in the next time; spinning? If so the kicker did it's job, the ball lift did it's job because it has traction on the ball. The only problem left is that the ball is not gaining traction due to too much oil. Sometimes just cutting back on the oil run 2 feet will cure this problem. If the ball is just sitting there after it's 3/4 way into the lift then you have a belt problem; it is not getting traction on the ball.
                        Sometimes a kicker will not pull a ball in. The next time it will pull it in but only spins after it gets there. If all the things the guys told you to check are ok, then try the distasnce on your oil pattern. You will be surprised how just a few mods can make all the difference in the world.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: kicker problem

                          If its getting 3/4 in then more likely the lift to low. I have the same problem with light ball on PBL. Raise the lift until the bal goes under the lift. I know the lift should be touching but try it.

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                          • #14
                            Re: kicker problem

                            IMO Toon got it. Even if you change the starter pad, the ball still has to compress the assembly. An easy way to tell would be to look at it from the top while in action. If the ball goes in and stops at the starter pad, something aint right in and around it. I dont know why certain balls will slide on by and some wont, but it happens.

                            Be careful with that thing if youve never taken one apart, it has major tension on the spring. Because of this tension, most of the ones I worked on reamed out the bolt holes creating the slop described. I drilled them out and used a larger bolt and found or created the right bushings. When you put it back together, look at it and make sure the bottom part doesnt stick out farther than the top, bend accordingly. When I finished my first one, I eliminated my most troublesome pair of lanes, which up till then ate a pair of kickers about every few weeks or so.

                            When it comes to lane oil, yes it has a profound effect on kicker operation. When I switched to Prodigy from Absolute HV, I fixed all but my most troublesome pairs (which were not oil related anyway). Just my $.02 on that one.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: kicker problem

                              Originally posted by mjs:
                              yes i placed a ball in the ball door lifted the ball lift and slowly let it down and stoped it when it just barely touched the ball.
                              <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">This is a ball lift clutch problem. Turn the other lane on and see if the balls come back.

                              Comment

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