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  • MP Chassis BE relay

    Just curious what you do first when a backend motor doesn't start for you and you find that you can make it run by holding the back end relay closed with an insulated screwdriver or something similar.

    Swap boards? Swap chassis? What is the usual culprit? C-1 pins? M relay?
    The impossible often has a kind of integrity to it which the merely improbable lacks.

  • #2
    Re: MP Chassis BE relay

    Being simi-stupid,
    I would change contacts/relay after switching in a different chassis.
    Always check the C-1 pins, my MP's are all single boards, so switching chassis(several spares) eliminates that intially.
    I have Super Stars and MP's, so many times I will switch one in for the other to eliminate possible other wiring probs.
    It's been awhile but I have much more to share!!!

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: MP Chassis BE relay

      Originally posted by *70*PinMonkey:
      Just curious what you do first when a backend motor doesn't start for you and you find that you can make it run by holding the back end relay closed with an insulated screwdriver or something similar.

      Swap boards? Swap chassis? What is the usual culprit? C-1 pins? M relay?
      <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">First I verify that it is in fact the chassis (BE relay). If a different MP acts the same way, more than likely it is a flakey Pit switch in the BE control box...since this cuts power to the coil for the BE relay.
      "Where are we going, and why are we in a hand basket?"

      --Kat

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: MP Chassis BE relay

        First, I would parallel the BE motor outputs through the C1A to half the load on the one set of contacts. (AA and W)
        Then, check the BE switch for continuity.
        Then, power the motor with a standard 110 outlet by hooking the motor to another 110 source and see if it starts.
        You need to isolate the source of the problem- so, 1) chassis (and the contacts on the relay), 2)C1A pins, 3)capacitor on the motor bad, 4) start switch on the motor bad, 5) start winding on the motor bad, 6) BE motor switch for continuity.
        If all else fails, replace the back end...........
        .
        .
        .
        This post is not an unpaid promotion of my business.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: MP Chassis BE relay

          If the BE relay isn't actually pulling in, I'd swap the board 1st, 2nd I check the C1 pins, 3rd, I'd eyeball the C2A, 4th check the T4 xfmr (if its one of them carppy ones that is internally fused) You can actually fix those damn xfmrs, by removing the outter layer of paper on the thing and replacing the crappy chinese fuse with a good one...(1 A micro fuse works well in this application. 5th - SEND IT ME! I have a mortgage! :p [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]
          I've had enough of hope & chains.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: MP Chassis BE relay

            You know the high-volt side of the relay works (as well as the motor), so you can eliminate that whole circuit.

            Your first step is always to swap the chassis (and perhaps the board too). That will help you eliminate large parts of the circuit.

            Once you know if it's machine or chassis (or board) get your circuit diagram out and trace the whole low-volt BE relay circuit:
            -T4 secondary (chassis)
            -C2A-313 (chassis/machine)
            -BE/Pit switch (machine)
            -C2A-13 (chassis/machine)
            -BE relay low volt contacts (chassis)
            -BE coil (chassis)
            -Card slot P2 pin 5 (#230) (chassis)
            -MP board

            You can eliminate part of the above by knowing whether the ball return is running. The M1 relay (which turns the ball return on) also uses T4, so if it is working, then T4 is fine (therefore you won't have to trace T4 primary circuit either). But that would only be a consideration if the problem follows the chassis.

            Then check the most likely things (that have not been eliminated): C2A pins are the most likely to fail or cause problems. Pit switches fail now and then. BE coils fail much less commonly.

            Be careful if you plan to test for voltage in the circuit, because there are 110V wires close to parts of this circuit. But you shouldn't need to resort to a live voltage test - a continuity tester should be all you need to find this (and with power disconnected obviously).

            Cheers,
            Andrew.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: MP Chassis BE relay

              1st, to get by use some sort of 110 jumper to the motor...

              2nd I use a penlite volt checker after that to see if the motor is getting juice

              3rd After that it should be chassis related


              FIXED! [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

              keep it simple
              If at first you don't succeed, try, try, again. Then quit. There's no use being a damn fool about it.&quot; -W.C.Fields

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: MP Chassis BE relay

                Originally posted by felix:
                1st, to get by use some sort of 110 jumper to the motor...

                2nd I use a penlite volt checker after that to see if the motor is getting juice

                3rd After that it should be chassis related


                FIXED! [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

                keep it simple
                <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yes, it's simple (which is good [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img] ) but I'm not quite sure it solves this problem.

                Monkey already got to step 3 and depending on whether he was fiddling the relay with a screwdriver, he may or may not have got juice to the motor in step 2.

                And he still can't assume it's the chassis as step 3 implies (but moving the chassis - a very simple step - would help answer that question).

                Sorry, I couldn't quite make it simple [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img] .

                Cheers,
                Andrew.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: MP Chassis BE relay

                  You are the man Andrew. You should build one of them robots for that show ... where they build robots that fight to the death. I forget what its called.
                  The impossible often has a kind of integrity to it which the merely improbable lacks.

                  Comment


                  • #11
                    Re: MP Chassis BE relay

                    Originally posted by *70*PinMonkey:
                    Just curious what you do first when a backend motor doesn't start for you and you find that you can make it run by holding the back end relay closed with an insulated screwdriver or something similar.

                    Swap boards? Swap chassis? What is the usual culprit? C-1 pins? M relay?
                    <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">My pin chasers are taught...

                    1st, to get by use some sort of 110 jumper to the motor...(this should eliminate the windings and rotating switch) or indicate Motor problems.

                    2nd I use a penlite volt checker or (volt meter) after that to see if the motor is getting juice.( I suppose its getting juice because you can start it without the jumper)

                    3rd M1 relay (old style) can be depressed manually, MP chassis. If this works you can switch the wires around on this relay..Use the otherside contacts.


                    4th change chassis
                    and should be able to see step five coming

                    5th would be the C-1

                    Andrew; I took it as to one step at a time [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif[/img]
                    If at first you don't succeed, try, try, again. Then quit. There's no use being a damn fool about it.&quot; -W.C.Fields

                    Comment


                    • #12
                      Re: MP Chassis BE relay

                      I don't like anyone touching my chassis's

                      6th would be an Mp board
                      If at first you don't succeed, try, try, again. Then quit. There's no use being a damn fool about it.&quot; -W.C.Fields

                      Comment


                      • #13
                        Re: MP Chassis BE relay

                        Originally posted by *70*PinMonkey:
                        You should build one of them robots for that show ... where they build robots that fight to the death. I forget what its called.
                        <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I think it's called Robot Wars, and yes I'd love to do that.

                        Imagine if people on Bowltech got together and built a 'Bowltech Bot'. It would not only crush, mame and annihilate, but it would leave the human controller crying for mummy.

                        Or, we could just plonk an A2 in the ring. [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]

                        Andrew.

                        Comment


                        • #14
                          Re: MP Chassis BE relay

                          Monkey
                          Put a snall brick on the relay when you need this chassis [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img] Then follow earlier posts
                          Go Pirates

                          Comment


                          • #15
                            Re: MP Chassis BE relay

                            It's called Robot Wars over here too.

                            Quote:
                            "Or, we could just plonk an A2 in the ring."

                            LOL!
                            [img]/content/btubb/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]
                            Bring me the freshest "Mean Green" known to man! Juice on!

                            Comment

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