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Random double cycling issue


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  • Random double cycling issue

    Ok, so I've been chasing this problem on lane 1 for a while now. The machine will intermittently double cycle only after the machine respots standing pins. Sometimes it happens instantly after coming to zero degrees, sometimes there is a delay.

    I've ruled out the reset linkage, dashpot ect as I've witnessed the solenoid pulse on several occasions when the problem occurs.

    We have Steltronic scoring, and the scoring system is not scoring on these random cycles. The Steltronic pinsetter interface computer which sits on the wall by the pinsetters is not showing that it is getting a cycle signal via the LED lights on said computer. For this reason I don't think it's Steltronic that is causing the problem.

    Im finding this problem to be very weird. If anyone has seen similar issues and can point me in the right direction that would be awesome. Thanks!

  • #2
    I should also mention that I've ruled out the bowlers reset button by disconnecting it and still having the same issue.


    • #3
      We have Steltronic. Did you try cleaning sensors on camera and reflectors? Sometimes dirt and debris will make it cycle.


      • #4
        change the reflector for the i/r dirty or bad will cause ghost cycling


        • #5
          I have tried cleaning the reflectors with no luck. I don't believe this to be the issue though only because it is my understanding that if the ball detection system is "seeing" a ball that is not there then Steltronic will score a 0. This is not the case, no score is taken when this happens.


          • #6
            One of the first things I would look at is the rake down switch inside the electrical box. More specifically the lever that sticks out the back of it that catches the clip on the rake cross member.
            If this clip has shifted, or the lever has worn from years of use it could cause this problem.
            This would also explain the no score, as the machine is sending the signal to the solenoid, instead of the scoring system.
            You don't have to be crazy to do this job...But it helps!


            • #7
              Good thought, but we don't have rake down switches here, as there is an infrared sensor out on the lane mounted to the same bracket as the scoring camera. This is where the pinsetter gets its cycle signal from.

              I should also mention that I changed the time delay module to no avail.


              • #8
                So lets think about this, what cycles the machine? answer: the automatic triggering according to what you posted. Change the reflector (they do go bad} then change the i/r. If it still does it you have a problem in the interface (you already said you disconnected the reset button at the main box, so you have nothing left)


                • #9
                  Check that IR module and reflectors are tight. Vibration is often the cause of intermittent cycling


                  • #10
                    I would check the 180 interlock adjustment, a little to much pressure won't spot an empty deck, but if pins fall intro empty deck at 180 during second cycle it can cause machine to reset, very random, also would explain why it dose not score because it is a mechanical issue.


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by emcnelis View Post
                      Good thought, but we don't have rake down switches here, as there is an infrared sensor out on the lane mounted to the same bracket as the scoring camera. This is where the pinsetter gets its cycle signal from.

                      I should also mention that I changed the time delay module to no avail.
                      You mentioned initially that it occurs only after re-spotting pins. This would lead me to a GB clutch adjustment since the clutch stops later at the end of a standing pins cycle.

                      Are the rake switches physically removed or are they still there but aren't used?

                      You then said you witnessed the cycle solenoid energize when the recycling occured...was this once to initiate the cycle and again after the cycle started? If you get a double cycle pulse to the solenoid that would say the rake switches are still connected and the machine was cycled by either the reset button or the scoring, which I assume is paralleled with the reset circuit since you still have TDM's.

                      It's just a bit odd that it occurs only after re-spotting AND you see the cycle solenoid energize AND you don't get a score. I can only assume from this that there's an intermittent short in the reset circuit...but only on 1st ball standing pins...? It might be worth swapping that interface computer with another pair to rule out the scoring.
                      Factory & Converted A-2 (US, Ger, Jap)
                      Comscore ECT, Matrix & DuoHD
                      Walker B, Sanction Standard, Original K, Flex Walker & Ikon
                      Kegel C.A.T.S


                      • #12
                        After watching the machine some more, I finally saw it double cycle after spotting new pins, so it is not only after standing pins, which makes more sense for sure.

                        I changed the infrared sensor to no avail. Going to try changing out the pinsetter interface next.


                        • #13
                          The world is waiting my friend........


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