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  • A2 Pinsetter Backend Motor

    Can anyone help with where to locally get the backend pinsetter motor for A2 machine and specs for motor...frame size, rpm, etc....

  • #2
    Don’t know specifics other than it’s a 1hp motor. I don’t work on A-2’s any more.
    * this space left blank intentionally *

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    • #3
      Schemm Bowling He has a lot of motors. I do not know if he has any new ones but he stands behind his products.

      Schemm Bowling Inc. – Serving the Bowling Industry Since 1977

      schemm.com













      Everything has to be Somewhere !!

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      • #4
        1725 rpm, 5/8" shaft, I think it is. Quality sells them. Grainger has a farm duty motor that can be adapted over with a mounting kit -- we did that with two machines when we tried reopening last month. I don't have the Grainger part numbers handy, but you should be able to find them with a bit of forum searching. In fact, as I'm typing this, the "related topics" at the bottom is showing two message threads asking about Grainger motors...

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        • #5
          Grainger has their MotorMatch tool. Just enter the specs off the plate on your old motor and it'll come up with choices you can browse through.
          -- Larry

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Mok View Post
            1725 rpm, 5/8" shaft, I think it is. Quality sells them. Grainger has a farm duty motor that can be adapted over with a mounting kit -- we did that with two machines when we tried reopening last month. I don't have the Grainger part numbers handy, but you should be able to find them with a bit of forum searching. In fact, as I'm typing this, the "related topics" at the bottom is showing two message threads asking about Grainger motors...
            Do you build the mounting kit? Or is it something you can also buy through Grainger?

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            • #7
              That is also a Grainger part. I was just looking for the part numbers, and I'm having trouble figuring out just exactly which one the motor was. Problem being as I'm furloughed, I don't have access to the work PC to look those up. I *think* the mounting kit is 3M130.

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              • #8
                I use Grainger #6K311 1.5hp 145T frame. With BPAA Disc it's $302. Been using them for about 8 years with no issues
                jonesborobowl.com

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                • #9
                  Try this Motor set-up with Grainger parts this has pictures just search this site

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by coachlon View Post
                    I use Grainger #6K311 1.5hp 145T frame.
                    My GM was at the center today, so I stopped in and looked at the email in my shop; this is in fact the animal. 6K311 motor with the 3M130 mounting kit. Has a starter cap and a run cap. Thermal overload. The lot. Square box on the side for easy access to the wires and installation of the power cord.

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                    • #11
                      That motor is a 1.5 HP while the original is a 1 HP. You don't want to throw a larger motor in your machine for several reasons.

                      First off, you'll probably run into a code violation. Branch circuit wiring, overload protection and short circuit protection are all determined based on the motor. If you swap the motor without adjusting associated wiring you may be in violation of the code and you could be held responsible if something catches fire.

                      Second, the locked rotor amps for the 1.5 HP is going to be larger. The motor experiences the locked rotor condition every time it starts and so your inrush current will be greater which can cause nuisance tripping and shorten the life of undersized protective equipment.

                      Third, motors are selected based on the load. Generally, you want a motor that operates between 75% and 100% of the load. So for a 1 HP motor, the load may be somewhere in the neighborhood of 3/4 HP. So a motor running at 75% for a 1 HP is only going to be at 50% for a 1.5 HP given the same load.

                      Why does it matter that the motor runs so far under load. Well the manufacture designs the motor to run the most efficient at the designated output load. It will still run at more than 1 HP and it will run at less than 1 HP but if will run most efficiently at around 1 HP. So when you stick on a 1.5 HP motor running such a small load, it's inefficient and that means more dollars to run it and generally more dollars to buy it.

                      Furthermore, when you oversize the motor, it affects the slip which affects the motor speed.

                      Finally, you can calculate the HP using the following formula. HP = V * A * Eff * PF * 0.002319 where V is the voltage, A is the Amperage, Eff is the efficiency and PF is the power factor. We've already talked about Eff but when you oversize a motor, you cause the PF to drop as well. This means higher current draw (above the already increased current caused by the larger winding used in the larger motor) which means your drawing more reactive load as well. Reactive load is the energy necessary to generate the magnetic field in the motor which is returned to the power company when the magnetic field collapses. So you use it for free. Power companies don't like this and is why they penalize you for having a low PF because they have to generate more power that they send to you only to have your equipment send it back to them but none the less the law requires them to be able to supply the demand so they don't have much choice. It also means they have to have larger transmission lines, transformers, switches, etc which all cost money that they wouldn't have to spend if people didn't have low PF's. While 1 motor won't be the end of the world, for them is is the collection of 1 motors that adds up to be the problem. So in addition to spending more money to run an over sized motor that is less efficient, you may also see a higher PF fee on you bill.

                      And this only scratches the surface. So while you can put a Cummings Engine out of a Mack Truck in your Honda Civic and while it may look cool as hell, it's just not the most efficient way to drive around town.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by exMech View Post
                        That motor is a 1.5 HP while the original is a 1 HP. You don't want to throw a larger motor in your machine for several reasons.

                        First off, you'll probably run into a code violation. Branch circuit wiring, overload protection and short circuit protection are all determined based on the motor. If you swap the motor without adjusting associated wiring you may be in violation of the code and you could be held responsible if something catches fire.

                        Second, the locked rotor amps for the 1.5 HP is going to be larger. The motor experiences the locked rotor condition every time it starts and so your inrush current will be greater which can cause nuisance tripping and shorten the life of undersized protective equipment.

                        Third, motors are selected based on the load. Generally, you want a motor that operates between 75% and 100% of the load. So for a 1 HP motor, the load may be somewhere in the neighborhood of 3/4 HP. So a motor running at 75% for a 1 HP is only going to be at 50% for a 1.5 HP given the same load.

                        Why does it matter that the motor runs so far under load. Well the manufacture designs the motor to run the most efficient at the designated output load. It will still run at more than 1 HP and it will run at less than 1 HP but if will run most efficiently at around 1 HP. So when you stick on a 1.5 HP motor running such a small load, it's inefficient and that means more dollars to run it and generally more dollars to buy it.

                        Furthermore, when you oversize the motor, it affects the slip which affects the motor speed.

                        Finally, you can calculate the HP using the following formula. HP = V * A * Eff * PF * 0.002319 where V is the voltage, A is the Amperage, Eff is the efficiency and PF is the power factor. We've already talked about Eff but when you oversize a motor, you cause the PF to drop as well. This means higher current draw (above the already increased current caused by the larger winding used in the larger motor) which means your drawing more reactive load as well. Reactive load is the energy necessary to generate the magnetic field in the motor which is returned to the power company when the magnetic field collapses. So you use it for free. Power companies don't like this and is why they penalize you for having a low PF because they have to generate more power that they send to you only to have your equipment send it back to them but none the less the law requires them to be able to supply the demand so they don't have much choice. It also means they have to have larger transmission lines, transformers, switches, etc which all cost money that they wouldn't have to spend if people didn't have low PF's. While 1 motor won't be the end of the world, for them is is the collection of 1 motors that adds up to be the problem. So in addition to spending more money to run an over sized motor that is less efficient, you may also see a higher PF fee on you bill.

                        And this only scratches the surface. So while you can put a Cummings Engine out of a Mack Truck in your Honda Civic and while it may look cool as hell, it's just not the most efficient way to drive around town.
                        exMech what motor would you suggest to replace the standard ones? This is all great information that I hadn't heard yet. A few years ago i stumbled across a bowltech post that said 1 1/2 HP is the way to go. And since then I have replaced 2 motors with a 1 1/2 HP Dayton motor from Grainger. Id love to know which motors you use to replace. Thanks!
                        -Oz

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                        • #13
                          I don't really have a recommendation for you. I generally try to steer clear of making specific equipment recommendations. I'll be happy to answer questions you may have but I'll leave the shopping to you. Most motor manufactures have online selection tools or distributors that are more then willing to help you make a selections. Just don't let them sell you the gold when silver will do.

                          With that being said, a 1HP motor will generate 1HP on the output shaft. That is what UL tests and not the input HP. The input horsepower will vary depending on the manufacture and the efficiency of the motor. So many of the variables in picking a motor are not related to the HP rating at all. They include things like frame size, bearing selection, mounting type, whether it's being used in a hazardous location or put out in the rain. Motor speed, capacitor start/run, voltage are also things to consider. Eliminating many of these variables will greatly reduce your selection choices. One thing to consider is the service factor (S.F. on the nameplate) This indicates how much the motor can be overloaded for short duration's without damaging the motor. A 10 HP motor with an SF of 1 should not exceed a 10 HP load for any time. However, the same motor with a 1.15 SF rating can take loads of 11.5 HP for short duration's. This is sometimes an indication that you may be getting a little better built motor that can withstand a little more.

                          With all that being said, don't overthink it. You need a 1 HP motor running at around 1725 RPM at the required voltage. Try to get one with a good efficiency rating. It also needs to fit your frame or you may need to get the drill out, buy a piece of steel and make yourself an adapter if ones not available. I've heard of people using standard grade farm duty motors with great success. But if you want to spend the bucks, you can find motors for north of $600. It may also depend on what you have locally. Grainger always seemed a little high priced to me but if you have a store locally, it may be cheaper to buy one from them then to buy a cheaper motor elsewhere and have to pay to get it shipped in. You know what they say; location, location, location.

                          I've been out of the bowling business for several years now so I can't honestly tell you what is available. Truth be told, I never bought a new motor. I had three or four spares that were very seldom used and when they were, I took the damaged unit to the motor shop and had it gone through and repaired. Of course we had a descent motor shop back then. But keep your machine in good running order with lube where it needs to be. Adjust your machines so the frame is where it should be and then adjust the deck new pin setting height. The first motor I ever burnt up was because I adjusted the deck using the link adjustment rather than adjusting the frame height after a sanding of the lanes. A lot of strain is put on the motor during those last few inches and it makes a difference.

                          Let me know of any other questions. Good luck.

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                          • #14
                            Personally I have been using the 6K311 motor from Grainger, and have had no problems, or side effects.
                            Also have to add the motor adaptor kit from Brunswick, or anywhere else that sells one.

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                            • #15
                              That's one of the 1.5HP units that he's recommending against, however. And apparently Quality didn't get the memo, because their motor is 1.5HP as well. Plus, lest we forget... Quality is owned by Brunswick. The outfit that made the machines.

                              That being said, maybe I'll sit down and see if Dayton has a similar motor in 1HP. As soon as I stop spending hours upon hours playing Prison Architect.

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