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  • lights come on but mach doesnt run?

    I have A-2 (jap) machines. When I turn power
    on my deck light comes on but machine doesent
    run. I have changed out my 110 contactor and
    my 24v contactor,with new, and still have same problem.
    Any suggestions?

  • #2
    Re: lights come on but mach doesnt run?

    If it is a Jap box then the motor circuit passes thur the motor overload protction(it is under the motor contactor).Yon can take a meter and check if power is present.
    Peanut

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: lights come on but mach doesnt run?

      MOMENTARILY engage J-24 (I use a plastic probe to push on relay buttons) if machine startsc then you have open low voltage switch, usually jam switch.

      Motor overload protector will cause same problem... just push in on thermal protector. Might have wrong rated thermal (coiled wire) across terminal.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: lights come on but mach doesnt run?

        Roger...I'm sorry, but I must disagree with you. I am sure that you meant well with your suggestion, but, may I suggest to you and anybody else who may have read your suggestion...NEVER push on a relay to test it. That action...however brief you try to make it could break a 1:1 cover or turret frame. A better way to check a contactor to see if it is working is to take a meter to the machine and check the voltage to the coil. Unless you are leaving your electrical box covers off (which is unsafe), you are going to have to get a tool to remove the cover anyway. Grab the meter while you are getting a screwdriver or wrench. Anybody pushing on a coactor to test it is inviting a very expensive repair bill. I'm sure Roscoe would agree. Roscoe, how many have you changed because somebody bypassed the safety devices on the machine.


        Rookie...Masternut is correct, look at the thermal overload device.
        More specific:
        check voltage between wires 112 and 113 (top of thermal overload)...should be 208, if not...you are not getting voltage out of the motor contactor...but because you stated that the light comes on, we will assume you have voltage there.

        check voltage on wires 23 and 72 (bottom of thermal overload)...should be 208...if not, the thermal overload is bad. If it were tripped...the motor contactor would not come on...thus not turning on the light. So I suspect you will find voltage there.

        Lastly...remove the receptacle for the motor in the electrical channel and check the connections there. If your machine still has the original Japanese connectors, you will see three wires soldered to the connector. Or you will probably find only two soldered on and one burned away. This problem is very common on Japanese machines that still sport the original connectors. You can solder it back on, but I would recommend replacing it with an American version. If all three wires are present, measure the voltage there and see if 208 is present. If it is...check the plug on the motor or the motor is bad. If voltage is not present, then you may have melted a wire between the thermal overload and the receptacle.
        I hope all this helps...

        Just my two cents worth...

        Steve

        [This message has been edited by JBEES (edited 11-20-2000).]
        TSM & TSM Training Development
        Main Event Entertainment
        480-620-6758 for help or information

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: lights come on but mach doesnt run?

          Roger:
          Jbees is absolutely correct, never push a motor start or contactor manually. Its not only dangerous for the machine, it is also, for the mechanic. To those whom insist on doing so, unplug the motor, wont help you but the machine at least has a chance. Some japs had thermal in motor, if not, check voltage at motor plug, if not present, work backwards. If present, work forwards (ie) motor.
          Good luck.
          Roscoe
          rfm

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: lights come on but mach doesnt run?

            It's never my first choice to manually engage
            a relay or contactor but if you feel you must
            then remove the motor to gearbox belt before you engage the relay or take both belts off completely.That way you will not do any real damage to the machine.I would check the motor
            plug recepticle in the wire channel I have had several problems with wires in the recepticle being bad.

            [This message has been edited by David Johnson (edited 11-21-2000).]

            [This message has been edited by David Johnson (edited 11-21-2000).]

            [This message has been edited by David Johnson (edited 11-21-2000).]

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: lights come on but mach doesnt run?

              I once had a similar problem on a japanese pinsetter which had confounded all the local mechs turned out to be the fuse holder went bad. Not sure off top of my head which but takes the place of the 3.2 amp fuse on a's. I always check fuses with meter also Because I have replaced more fuses where the fuse link broke because of vibration than have blown.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: lights come on but mach doesnt run?

                David:
                Have found removing belts, excessive work, especially on swing motor mounts where motor pullys will engage turret drive idler pulleys if energised. Have gotten into the habit of just unplug the motor, anytime, that I want to diagonse an electrical problem.
                Then when I turn machine on, all I have to look at is electrical box, to see if it passes the smoke test.
                Your friend in the business:
                Roscoe
                rfm

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: lights come on but mach doesnt run?

                  Roscoe,
                  I would normally agree with what you have said but in rookiemechanics problem the motor would not run so unplugging the motor would not help him to figure out if its getting power or not.As far as the swing motor mount is concern on all the jap A-2 I have ever worked on the motors are not the swing type.

                  [This message has been edited by David Johnson (edited 11-22-2000).]

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: lights come on but mach doesnt run?

                    I had the same problem with one pinsetter. It turned out to be the counter control cable...the cable where you put the jumper wire. Well...2 of the 3 wires were touching each other inside the electrical box causing the contactor to open. I don't know much about electrical boxes...I WISH I DID...but just to let you know what to look for next time you have the same problem. I do agree with everyone on NOT to test a relay by pushing it manualy. That's like sticking a paperclip or some other kind of metal object into a socket or touching a hot wire. Use a volt meter to check for voltage and/or continuity in the wires. I know my basics when working with electricity...I took Basic Electronics in High School...good class to take!! I think bowl-tech should put something in the reference section about the electrical boxes. How they work, what does what, what is this, how much voltage here and there...I'd like to know how these work!

                    ßA

                    ßA

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: lights come on but mach doesnt run?

                      Sorry people! What little brain I have left went south on previous reply.

                      I do not condone nor practice bypassing safety features on any machine! My post went into cyberland before I had a chance to reread it. Didn't mean to imply bypassing jam switch... meant to test intergrity of J-24 and J-100 but got two thoughts in my head at same time and hit "enter" by mistake. Lost connection and chance to redeem myself.

                      Rookie indicted pin light was on which on my Jap A-2s is not a jam situation (not a blackout).

                      I did have a J-100 do what rookie's did... light pin light but not start motor. Had proper power at coil posts but relay did not fully engage. Outside, the relay looked fine but couldn't see contacts inside. Bumped it once with my plastic pen, motor came on and machine ran. Got through the night and replaced said J-100 next day. Probably a bad contact I couldn't see.

                      Again, I'm very sorry for implying that anyone should attempt a safety switch bypass. Will not hit "enter" again until I've reread and reread.

                      Comment

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