Half Scale Candlepins (attempt #2)

[Candlepin_Guy]

Hey guys, not sure if anyone remembers but I contacted James Garland (The company who makes full scale regulation candlepins) about a year or so ago about getting some half scale candlepins made up. (Regulation Candlepins are all synthetic made from a plastic tube material so that they're hollow and capped at each end)

He said that they'd have to be solid plastic and not hollow and that even though there is less material involved the extra programing involved on the CNC machine brought the price per pin close to what a full scale pin costs for 10.

10 = $36.50 each
20 = $25.00 each
50 = $15.50 each
100 = $12.75 each

Now, my question is since we have some new members here with the ability to do some pretty amazing things, is it possible to get some made up at a lower price point? I understand that the material is fairly expensive but I just thought I'd run it by everyone!

Thanks, Nick

[theultimateandy]

It looks like a scaled down pin would be 7 7/8" tall by 1 1/2" at its thickest point. 1 1/2" thick HDPE rod is running about $12 a foot. You won't need a full foot per pin, but you will need to take into account extra for attaching to the lathe. I don't think you need a CNC machine to make the pins, just a pattern like Phil has that is attached to his lathe. I believe Phil does this kind of work as a profession, you may want to contact him for a price quote. I have a lathe but it's not big enought to support an 8" piece of stock. I can't do templates on it either. Hope this helps.

[moosehead]

Hey if we can get the cost down im interested in 20-24 of them. I was trying to find out pricing from a place here last week they were wanting about the same price

[frobzwiththingz]

Hey if we can get the cost down im interested in 20-24 of them. I was trying to find out pricing from a place here last week they were wanting about the same price

Hey there all. I believe I could make these in small batches for $175 for a set of 10.

[moosehead]

Hey there all. I believe I could make these in small batches for $175 for a set of 10.

how much for a set of 20

[Stevejt66]

I may be interested in 10 or 20 of them, if the price is right, I like the $120 for a set of 10 or better yet, if a little lower for 20 of them. what kind of ball would we use? maybe a pool ball? I think I would have to make removeable inserts inside my pinsetter tubes to set them using my current pinsetter.

[moosehead]

I may be interested in 10 or 20 of them, if the price is right, I like the $120 for a set of 10 or better yet, if a little lower for 20 of them. what kind of ball would we use? maybe a pool ball? I think I would have to make removeable inserts inside my pinsetter tubes to set them using my current pinsetter.

I think pool balls would be great, I bought some from Epco that are unmarked, they have the swirled colors like a lot of candle pin balls have, I would think for pin tubes we could just us 1.5 inch PVC pipe. If we can get these down to $100 a set Im IN!

[Candlepin_Guy]

I can handle $120 a set I think. Pool balls I believe are the correct size since Candlepin ball is 4.5" in diameter and pool balls are 2.25". I'm worried about the weight though. Regulation pool balls only weigh 5.5 to 6 oz. If the pins end up weighing around the same it should be good! I'm sure HDPE weighs less than the "Gar-Dur" material real candlepins are made of but these pins will also be solid and not hollow. Who knows! Only way to find out is have one made and see how much it weighs. As a rough estimate, does anyone know how much does a 7 7/8th rod of HDPE weighs roughly?

[frobzwiththingz]

I can handle $120 a set I think. Pool balls I believe are the correct size since Candlepin ball is 4.5" in diameter and pool balls are 2.25". I'm worried about the weight though. Regulation pool balls only weigh 5.5 to 6 oz. If the pins end up weighing around the same it should be good! I'm sure HDPE weighs less than the "Gar-Dur" material real candlepins are made of but these pins will also be solid and not hollow. Who knows! Only way to find out is have one made and see how much it weighs. As a rough estimate, does anyone know how much does a 7 7/8th rod of HDPE weighs roughly?

I estimate the volume of a half-scale candlepin to be pretty close to 12 cubic inches. This is not by any fancy math, just looking at it as a plain old cylinder and taking a wild-ass guess of 10% off for the volume lost to the curved ends. HDPE has a density of about .97gm/cm^3, or about .56 oz/in^3, so a half scale candlepin made out of solid HDPE would weigh about 6.5 ounces. I have no actual evidence for this, but I'd be amazed if the "Gar-Dur" material that Garland uses is anything other than UHMWPE (or UHMW for short). It's another polyethylene thermoplastic, longer polymer chains than HDPE. It is pretty much the highest impact resistance thermoplastic commonly available. Somewhat counter to intuition, UHMW is actually lighter than HDPE, though not by very much.
Make your pins out of that, and they'd be more like 6.375 ounces instead. From a machining perspective, HDPE is *much* nicer to deal with than UHMW. It's also a bit cheaper.

If I got enough people ordering, (like, 5 or more sets), I could go down to $150 a set for making them. If there were more than 10 sets wanted, you'd be better off getting Garland to make them
for you.

[Candlepin_Guy]

Sounds good! As long as its fairly close. Epco not only makes pool balls (along with candlepin and duckpin balls) but they make balls for whatever. They should be able to make a 2.25 inch ball that weighs what we need to be a match with the pins. Plus they'll look like a real ball too!

[brokenpin]

If Epco can make balls I wonder if they could make pins? Anyone ask them?

[Candlepin_Guy]

I have a lead into some real Bowl-mor parts that I believe I can use to build a half-scale pinsetter for the lane I plan on building. Wish me luck! I really think I need to get my head checked out by a professional lol

[theultimateandy]

If that's the case, then I need to be locked up in a white suit with a daily enema. You really have it so much easier than us 10 pin guys. You don't have to worry about clearing deadwood after the first ball, no respot cells, only one type of cycle, no oor/ os, no head first mis-feeds, and I am sure I am missing some other stuff as well; oh yea, so touch
I am sure you will do just fine. I have only seen a few videos of candlepin machines on youtube. Can't wait to see what you come up with.

[Candlepin_Guy]

Ha! Definitely true Andy. I have it much easier! And since I wont have to make any of the chain drives myself, it's even easier.

[foolface]

Hi,

Noob here just starting too look into making a scale set. Just curious if this ever happened with the Garland order and if you found the weight of the 1/2 scale pins to find matching Epco balls?

Thanks
Matt